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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:34 am 
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Here is an opposition link to the Fuel oil plant that is to be constructed in Wellsville:
http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/astev ... erg_2.html

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:15 pm 
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As much as I don't want to see us not be able to ride at Wellsville I do not agree with the Greenies. If we can make oil from coal I think we should. I guess this is a situation where I get to ask myself if I am willing to sacrifice for what I believe in. Much like my support for the war in Iraq. I did some real soul searching about that when I found out that my son was going there.
In this situation the coal plant could provide lots of jobs to an area that really needs them. Could help us stop using so much OPEC oil. but we lose a place to play.
Just thinking out loud.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:59 pm 
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Haha I was thinking the same thing earlier like damn I want to support the people who really hate offroaders. Kinda a catch 22 haha, but f'it I will hug some trees to save Wellsville.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:12 pm 
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You did your part in November to stop coal technology.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:15 pm 
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Thank you yes I did, I did it for the buggies! Like I said I do what it takes to get the better or two evils hahaha

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:49 pm 
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2009 9:31 pm 
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making oil from coal is the plan but at what cost? according to the article, Baard publicly suggests that it will use carbon capture and sequestration and biomass to reduce pollution. now they wont commit to doing so.
Baard makes application with the Department of Energy for loans and says it would utilize biomass as 30% of its feedstock but now its not for the first 10 years of operations. seems like bait and switch tactics.
sure we need to reduce our dependence on foreign oil, never mind the impact on the environment at this point, i am far from being a tree hugger just ask anyone that rides with me, i strap my chainsaw in the back seat and take it for a ride all the time. (the saw loves it) what about the risk to our health or our children's health when there's technology that can significantly reduce this risk.
Is this just another case of big business trying to make a large profit and not caring about the common folk that have to breath this stuff.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 3:42 am 
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I am guessing that now that the price of oil is so low and the economy is so slow that this project is on hold somewhere. I still would not put much stock in this article. It was written by Hippies. The same ones who say we should stop building windfarms because it kills birds. The cleanest energy you can get and they are against it.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 5:10 pm 
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they want to tear up wellsville and pollute the whole area. You also have to think of where they will get all of this coal from. with the new coal mining techniques they use, it destroys the land and habitats in other regions, i have been riding out in Cabin Creek, West Virginia, for 25 years now, and if you have ever seen mountain top removal, it would make you want to cry. they say they reclaim the land, but its not, its rocks and briar bush, no hills, no trees, nothing, its just devestating. every year i go down there, theres another mountain gone. these big corporations got the pollititions in thier hands and they can do anything they want. they dont care about the little people. Its just corporate greed.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:51 pm 
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afterburnt wrote:
they want to tear up wellsville and pollute the whole area. You also have to think of where they will get all of this coal from. with the new coal mining techniques they use, it destroys the land and habitats in other regions, i have been riding out in Cabin Creek, West Virginia, for 25 years now, and if you have ever seen mountain top removal, it would make you want to cry. they say they reclaim the land, but its not, its rocks and briar bush, no hills, no trees, nothing, its just devestating. every year i go down there, theres another mountain gone. these big corporations got the pollititions in thier hands and they can do anything they want. they dont care about the little people. Its just corporate greed.



Without corporate greed where will the little people work?

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:07 pm 
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D. Marks wrote:
afterburnt wrote:
they want to tear up wellsville and pollute the whole area. You also have to think of where they will get all of this coal from. with the new coal mining techniques they use, it destroys the land and habitats in other regions, i have been riding out in Cabin Creek, West Virginia, for 25 years now, and if you have ever seen mountain top removal, it would make you want to cry. they say they reclaim the land, but its not, its rocks and briar bush, no hills, no trees, nothing, its just devestating. every year i go down there, theres another mountain gone. these big corporations got the pollititions in thier hands and they can do anything they want. they dont care about the little people. Its just corporate greed.



Without corporate greed where will the little people work?


wow! talk about a "catch-22" :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:11 pm 
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I don't like the environmental nut jobs one bit. If it were up to them humans would be wiped off the planet. I hate the idea of losing a great place to ride but that is just the luck of the draw. It is going to be built somewhere, it just happened to be in the place that was dear to us. With any project there is always a NIMBY crowd (Not In My Back Yard), this time it just happens to be us. :roll:

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:16 pm 
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They will definately strip mine wellsville to get the coal, not underground, i gaurantee it. And as far as mountain top removal goes, andrew is right, it really is devastating, it is so terrible looking, its almost depressing to see....

I agree with all sides, tough case, but man i do not want to lose wellsville. We will see, we will see....


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 1:09 am 
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OK I've got a plan!!!! When they start mining we will all go out there and jump our buggy's over the construction equiptment. Then all the workers will leave.

Ok I know it sounds stupid, but I saw them do it on a Dukes of Hazzard re-run on t.v. so it has to work! :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:57 pm 
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hey sounds like a good plan to me!

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 12:46 pm 
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Has anyone heard anymore about Baard? I bet the enviromentalists will really be watching that area this year. If they are worried about what Baard will do to the land they may be in there checking it out.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 01, 2009 8:16 am 
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this was in the local paper; Baard Energy moving ahead with plant plans
By PAUL GIANNAMORE, Business editor POSTED: March 27, 2009 Save | Print | Email | Read comments | Post a comment
Email: "Baard Energy moving ahead with plant plans"
*To: <--TO Email REQUIRED!
*From: <--FROM Email REQUIRED!


STEUBENVILLE - The Ohio River Clean Fuels project at Wellsville will have to work harder for financing without Department of Energy loan guarantees, but the coal-to-liquid fuels plant parent, Baard Energy LLC, says the project will move forward.

Baard issued a statement Thursday announcing it was pulling out of the process to seek loan guarantees for the project because of delays resulting from challenges by the National Resources Defense Council and the Sierra Club.

Essentially, Baard was going to pay about $1 million in unrefundable fees to the Department of Energy with no guarantee the loan backing would be made available in a timely fashion for construction of the plant, if at all.

John Baardson, chief executive officer of Baard Energy, said the challenges to permits issued by the Ohio Environmental Protection Agency and the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers would likely delay for years any funding from a Department of Energy guarantee. The DOE has told Baard that environmental lawsuits would be considered part of the department's evaluation of the risks of a project and guarantees wouldn't be made until suits were resolved.

"In our judgment, we did not think it was worthwhile to put at risk over $1 million of nonrefundable submission fees and associated costs to participate in any federal program that has this much uncertainty," Baardson said in Thursday's statement.

Baard's final permits for the plant were issued in November.

Baardson said the permit process included more than a year of scrutiny by OEPA, and many comments received from the National Resources Defense Council were included in the final permit terms and conditions.

The 2008 federal appropriations act authorized the Department of Energy to make loan guarantees up to $6 billion for coal gasification projects that incorporate carbon capture and sequestration, as well as $2 billion for loan guarantees for projects such as Ohio River Clean Fuels. The company responded to the DOE's application solicitation in September.

Steve Dopuch, Baard vice president, said the plans for the Ohio River Clean Fuels plant include capture and sequestration of carbon that will be used for enhanced oil recovery in western oil fields. Dopuch said the fuels the plant will make will have a 40 percent improvement in greenhouse gas emissions compared with petroleum fuels, including ethanol blends. He said the stack emissions would be cleaner than what already is coming out of coal-fired power plants.

The plant is expected to employ thousands in its construction and more than 400 operators in high-paying jobs once its completed. Ohio River Clean Fuels would convert coal and biomass into synthetic gas that would be further converted into 53,000 barrels a day of diesel and jet fuel, with napthta byproducts used as feedstock in the chemical industry.

Tracy Drake, executive director of the Columbiana County Port Authority, said the federal guarantees weren't necessary but would be helpful for Baard in obtaining financing.

"Baard is saying they're frustrated at the federal level and has said it will withdraw and do the financing on their own locally. They do not want to be in a situation where outside forces that have nothing to do with the marketplace or what is right for the country interfere in the ability to do private business," Drake said.

Baardson said the National Resource Defense Council already has submitted Freedom of Information Act requests seeking to review Baard's loan application, as was done in Ohio before suits were filed challenging the project's permits.

The company will proceed with the project without the loan guarantees.

"It is certainly going to be a little more difficult to set up regular financing," said Dopuch. "But we are bound and determined to proceed on the project. We're hopeful we still could break ground this summer, but that remains to be seen."

"This is a fully permitted plant by the Ohio EPA. It's shovel ready, site ready, fully permitted, a great project and a great plan," Dopuch said. "It's unfortunate the government is not going to make funding available for a project such as this.

"It does not make sense for us to spend over $1 million in nonrefundable submission fees and associated costs and not even know when or if we would get a loan guarantee," Dopuch said.

"Further, the DOE already told us some penalties will be assigned to our evaluation because of the lawsuits by the NRDC, and further, they might not even be able to provide funds until after these lawsuits are settled," he said. "Why would any company in its right mind buy into a program like that?"

Drake said the port authority was awarded $5.7 million in federal stimulus money Thursday to complete its riverfront industrial park in Wellsville and pave the way for the Baard plant.

The grant will pay for completion of the overhead crane and conveyor system central to the port authority's intermodal industrial park.

The money for the projects is coming through the portion of $787 billion in federal stimulus money set aside for transportation projects.

e local paper ;

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 01, 2009 11:13 am 
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Thats interesting news. I have had several calls into Steve Dopuch (the guy I have been talking with) for a month now and he has not returned any of them. I did know that they were having some funding Issues however it did not seem to be of concern to Steve to move foward with the plant. Now we know. It appears it will just take them longer to break ground and that works for me!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 01, 2009 7:16 pm 
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sounds good to me too maybe we will get lucky and they will not get the funding

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:09 am 
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Well we talked to the guys at oaktree this past weekend and we were told that Baard cannot secure the grant at this time, and they cannot raise their own monies currently and it will be at least next year.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:24 am 
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Well that is good news for us bad news for Wellsvilles economy.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:37 am 
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but look at all the money we spend there on ice and beer

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:36 pm 
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yea have you SEEN the Mcdonalds on memorial weekend! Better get there 30 mintues early to get breakfast :P

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:33 pm 
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Hell yeah there's no way the town of wellsville don't hit a lick :shock:
that many motel rooms, beer, food, ice ...the list goes on and on
I can't go ride at our local spot and not spend a BILL or two
And something else thats cool, The little store at the bottom of the hill in Wellsville had a lady and man working [owners] I don't know, But they had a daughter who lived near me in Ga....Small world


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:21 pm 
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cool thing about mcdonalds is they will take big orders over the phone that way it is ready when u get there. we have called in orders many time. they like it so they are not hit with a big order and no time to prepare

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