I have a set of 44 idf carbs brand new out of the box. I put the carbs on a 2332 with new heads. engle 110 cam and 42x37.5 valves. The problem i have is I cant get the fuel mixture right. I runs rich with 50 idle jets and the same with 40s. It actually runs as if it dont even have idle jets in it. It has the choke block off plates on them and they are plugged off. I messed with them for about 12 hours and finally decided to try another set of older carbs that came off my buggy. It ran fine with the old carbs on it. What can i be missing that would cause this problem?

I have a buggy with a 2332 with 44 IDFs, as well as another buggy with a 1915 and 44 IDFs. Most guys say that 44s are too big for a 1915 but they both run great. The 2332 buggy is similar to your setup, my engine is pretty new with only about 60 hours on it. This motor has CB performance Panchito heads, an Engle 120 cam, and 1.5 ratio rockers.

Here are a couple things I have learned over the past few years about carbs:

Even if they are brand new, you still need to clean them before installing. Every new set I have had were full of crap right out of the box.

The idle jet and idle screw setting combination is the most critical part of the setup (with linkage and synchonization being second). Start with the idle mixture screws exactly 1 and 1/2 turns out. I have found that either size 55 or size 60 idle jets will work almost every time (my 2332 has size 60's, the 1915 has size 55's). Both the idle jets and the idle mixture screws meter fuel, the jet is a fixed amount, and the screw is an adjustable amount. If the jet is too small, the screw will need two turns or more to get the mixture right. If the jet is too big, the screw will need less than one turn to get the mixture right. When the idle jet size is correct, the screws will be somewhere between 1 and 1/4 and 1 and 3/4 turns out.

The top gasket seal is pretty critical I just discovered recently. I had the 1915 buggy on a ride this past Thanksgiving where it would not run right no matter what I did. There was a hesitation then a "pop and go" every time I hit the throttle. It was aggravating and I tried everything. When I got it home, I discovered that the right carb had a bad top gasket that was allowing air to leak accross the venturis and a lot of other places that it shouldn't. Replaced the gasket, runs perfect.

If you don't have a synchronizer you may want to get one. Some guys think they can set this by ear but if you get it right using this method, it will be purely by accident. The other critical factor with synchronization is the linkage. Make sure the throttle plates lift at exactly the same time. I have worked on this for an hour or more to get it right, but it is worth it. Sometimes what seems like an idle jet problem is really a synchronization issue.

Just thinking about your size 50 then 40 idle jet setup, this sounds too small for a 2332 and it should have been way lean. What made you think it was running rich, did it die when idling? Did you smell rich exhaust or was it popping when idling? Did an increase in the idle speed screw (not the mixture screw) help it stay running?

I would try a set of 55 or 60 idle jets and a thoruogh cleaning. Get a few sets of new top gaskets, Ebay, 5 bucks each. Synchronize and set the timing, let it warm up. Make idle screw adjustments slowly, about 1/8th of a turn at a time. Wait to hear the result then go a little more. Keep track about how many turns out they are.

Good luck,

Dale Hall

_________________
Lets RIDE!

It would puff black smoke out the exaust with the 50s or the 40s. It shouldnt even run with those jets in it. The only way i could make it stay running was to run the idle srews way in, almost as far as they would go. WWhile running i could adjust on the idle mixture screws and the motor wouldnt respond. it sounded the same just rich and black smoke.It will eventually go dead and i would have to hold the throttle wide open to get it to fire back off. Then it would blow black smoke bad until it cleaned up. Ive ran webers for about 12 years and now and worked on several and never delt with a problem of this sort. Im lost.

How much fuel pressure and what are the floats set at? Anything more than 3 psi is too much. Floats should be 10.5mm I believe. Do you have a weber manual?

When it is idling, shine a flashlight down into the barrels and make sure fuel isn't dripping from the spray tubes. I had a set once that I rebuilt and the float needle seats would not cut off the fuel. These were brand new out of the kit but wouldn't work, fuel just leaked past them. The float bowl would fill up and drip raw fuel into the venturis. I had to change the needle seats back to the old ones and no more leaking. It ran about like what you are describing until I got them changed.

Like Aaron says, fuel pressure is also critical. Take the fuel pump out of the equation and let the bowls gravity feed and see if this helps.

_________________
Lets RIDE!

2.5 pounds of fuel pressure. ive checked multiple times. Ive allready checked for fuel leak down. I cant see them doing anything out of the ordinary. Thats why i believe the idle jets arent seating. whatever is going on is happening below the butterflys. Ive also pinned the throttle wide open without the motor running and the fuel pump running looking for leakdown below the butterflys like the progressive ports and still nothing. I just really dont make sense.

Although I have never actually seen this problem, I had a friend once that bought a set of carbs and the venturis were too large for the engine they were going on. My understanding was that the engine did not have enough volumetric air flow to make the carbs work properly and it ran super rich and genrally very sluggish until the vents were changed to smaller ones. This makes sense because when the air enters the vents, there has to be a velocity increase caused by the air being squeezed through the carbs to get everything to run right in the carb. Of course this comes from the engine running and pulling vacuum through the carbs and the smaller the vents are, the more the velocity increase is.

With a 2332, I wouldn't think that this would be a possibility but it might be worth checking if you have a smaller set of vents that can be robbed from another carb temporarily.

I can't think of anything else other than an intake leak or a fuel leak below the butterflies as you mentioned.

_________________
Lets RIDE!

Thanks for the input and yes that is correct. What i cant figure out is that my old carbs are exactly the same as the new ones. The venturies and all are the same. All i did was take the new jets out of the new ones and put them in my old ones and it ran fine. I still beleive i got a bad set of carbs. I talked to Rob herring about this last nite and he said his got a set once that had pit holes in the idle jet seats and wouldnt let the jets seat properly. Im thinking this is what i have also.

Accelerator pump is set to give it fuel too soon, need to adjust it to where it will give it fuel "later" as your throttle plates opens up, when the fuel goes in your motor at the wrong time (too soon) will create a richer mixture of air/fuel ratio, back out the tiny nut on the pump on the carb about 1/8 turn at a time to where it will no longer do it then go from there, the jets has nothing to do with the black smoke coming out the exhaust when you rap it, also check to see what your pump nozzle size is to see if they are still "50" on the nozzles, it should be from factory settings on that particular carb size......

_________________
"Loud pipes saves lives"

There is no fuel coming from the pump jets during idle. The only time fuel comes from the pump jets is when the throttle is opened. Ive looked in the carbs while its idleing and there is no fuel leaking or spraying anywhere. What ever is happening is taking place under the butterflys. I can turn the mixture screws all the way in and the motor dont respond it just keeps running and smoking black out the pipe. Ive adjusted the bypass screws all the way out and it still burns rich. Im calling Weber Direct tommorow where I got them from and see what they say. I just think its a carb problem with it running good with my old ones on it with the same jets and venturies.

10-4, it definitely sounds like a internal problem with the carb or is it both of them doing the same thing? I cannot define the odds of both carbs new out of the box doing the exact same thing at once, maybe there is something we missed on them new carbs??

_________________
"Loud pipes saves lives"

I dont know if its both of them or not but I really think it is. Ive never seen a buggy run that rich with just one carb bad. Its bad as to the point where after 20 to 30 seconds you have to leave the shop.

Choke or cold start circuit . Make sheer the plugges are down to block the hole going to the fuel bowl. Look and see if the check balls in the accelerator jet . And with the carb off how does the throttle plate cover the progression hole . I think it should be on the 2nd hole. Good Luck.

Ive checked everything I know to check and I called weber direct today. The carb are 3months out of warranty and they are gunna replace them. The guy that bought them lost his shop in the tornados down here in april. I explained to weber direct the situation with his loss and said that they would take care of it. Very good people to deal with and very understanding.