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| watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? http://www.woodsbuggy.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=16375 |
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| Author: | buggybarn [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 12:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Just wondering as far as hill climbing witch engine works the best if you had a choice . |
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| Author: | jeff69 [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Well down here in bama all the buggys I've seen is aircooled unless its a chaindrive but my 2165 cc stroker does pretty good but the 2500 to 2610cc will eat a hill up but they have a lot of money invested in them. I know up north the watercooled guys love the ecotechs Posted using the WoodsBuggy Mobile App iPhone |
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| Author: | jesse [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Ac is the best if your talking your conventional buggy if you wanna go mid engine or chaindrive then water |
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| Author: | diamonddav [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Blah blah blah:mrgreen: Posted using the WoodsBuggy Mobile App |
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| Author: | darrell [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
i love my air coooled come on air cooled any day now ...... |
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| Author: | darrell [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
darrell wrote: i love my air coooled come on air cooled any day now ...... i'm ready any time with my 19115
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| Author: | darrell [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
darrell wrote: darrell wrote: i love my air coooled come on air cooled any day now ...... i'm ready any time with my 1915 lets get this shi- over with with5 |
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| Author: | buggybarn [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 12:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
The only wc buggy I've ever seen climb is terrys . How does exra weight affect a buggy as far as climbing ? I have a 2276 now and like it . Am building a single seater and deciding on motor to put in it . So your sayn jesse it would need to be mid engine with chains to climb good . I'm sorry for all the ?s but I have no experience with wc and how they do . Everyone I ride with has vw but they cost so damn much to build . Thanks |
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| Author: | jesse [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
No im sure a wc conventional buggy can climb just fine but as far as what the best I believe vw works best on a conventional buggy I think you will climb more that way unless you mid engine the wc or a chaindribe then it will blow away the conventional buggy |
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| Author: | Jeremy1 [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 4:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
This was my first summer with a wc Ecotec and I have had a few different Vw engines over the last 13 years and my very first ride I wish I would of put one in 13 years ago. Fuel injection paired up to the low end torque it's a animal! Point and hold on! Uses half the gas my Vw did and not dealing with carbs is great! Blow up a stroker Vw and you cry! Blow up a Ecotec you head to the wreaking yard and pick another one up for 6 to 800 bucks Posted using the WoodsBuggy Mobile App |
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| Author: | MickeyMouse [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Here is my 2 cents... Let me start by saying that I am not a crazy climber, I prefer trail riding and my opinions below only pertain to Hill Climbing. Trail Riding would be a completely different assessment. ------------------------------------ In my opinion everything is a balance of Power and Weight. I believe it is easier to get more power out of a WC engine but you will most likely add additional weight. Yes... the Power is great but the extra weight can be a HUGE issue. A lighter buggy will be able to get up most hills easier and will not put as much stain on CV's and Transmissions. To compensate for the extra weight of the WC engine, everything else will need to be bigger, heavier and stronger. (Frame, Axles, Shocks, etc.. etc..) After spending a lot of time and money, you can get to the same balance of Power and Weight with a WC engine but then you start to run into traction issues. The lighter buggy will require less traction to continue forward momentum. To compensate for the traction, a heavier buggy will require larger tires and then we are back to CV and Transmission issues. As the end of the day, a AC buggy is hard to beat when you are trying to build a competitive hill climbing buggy. |
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| Author: | gasman [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Your building a s/s non chaindrive buggy. I've yet to see anything out climb a vw buggy in this kinda buggy. I know Terry built a bad ass single seater and I'd love to see a subie single seater built,but I have yet to see one climb the shit I've seen a vw buggy climb. Just saying I ain't seen it. Don't mean it can't be done and love to see the video or in person but until then I say AIR COOLED VW. Now I'll hang up and listen to the water boil,lol. Chad 
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| Author: | Terry fryer [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
My buggy is close. And as far as the weight I haven't had an issue. Actually gonna move some weight back after this past weekend helmetguy and kybuggy got the best of me. I couldn't get mine to bite ( to much power I guess  lol ) I still have a little tweaking to do but I honestly believe It can be done. It's all about gearing, and weight ratio's. And you can't beat the reliability of wc I have beat on my motor for about 4 years and never turned a wrench on it. If you go wc in a ss it takes alot of work. And I haven't seen very many 2 seat ac's go where bob simpkins puts his 2 seat eco buggy. 2 seaters are a little easier a set of 3x5's, the right gear, and a big set of nuts, you will climb the big hills. That is my 2 cents. I'm hoping by the end of next year me and helmetguy makes alot of believer's. I've done converted himLol Posted using the WoodsBuggy Mobile App |
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| Author: | 2800passat [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
MickeyMouse wrote: Here is my 2 cents... Let me start by saying that I am not a crazy climber, I prefer trail riding and my opinions below only pertain to Hill Climbing. Trail Riding would be a completely different assessment. ------------------------------------ In my opinion everything is a balance of Power and Weight. I believe it is easier to get more power out of a WC engine but you will most likely add additional weight. Yes... the Power is great but the extra weight can be a HUGE issue. A lighter buggy will be able to get up most hills easier and will not put as much stain on CV's and Transmissions. To compensate for the extra weight of the WC engine, everything else will need to be bigger, heavier and stronger. (Frame, Axles, Shocks, etc.. etc..) After spending a lot of time and money, you can get to the same balance of Power and Weight with a WC engine but then you start to run into traction issues. The lighter buggy will require less traction to continue forward momentum. To compensate for the traction, a heavier buggy will require larger tires and then we are back to CV and Transmission issues. As the end of the day, a AC buggy is hard to beat when you are trying to build a competitive hill climbing buggy. Well said, then ya need a bigger trailer, then ya need a bigger truck to pull and stop them both. |
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| Author: | buggybarn [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 1:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Thanks guys. My orange 2 seater with 2276 does me good she has taken me places . I'm building a ss and kinda lookin at the money thing I can get an ecotec for 310 or spend coin and put a vw. I can make the adp plt at work in the cnc . Decsions decsions lol. Thanks for everyones comments and sugestion that I will ponder on |
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| Author: | diamonddav [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 2:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Im gonna go w.c the next one i build. I still love the vw but financialy it makes sense. You can make a really nice buggy with the 3000 or so your gonna save on the motor! Im no purist for anything except common sense. Ive allready been stackin up parts for the next one;-) give it a go nick. U never know!! Ill always have my vw tho, best of both worlds:mrgreen: Posted using the WoodsBuggy Mobile App |
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| Author: | gasman [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Well no doubt the cheapest way to go is water,but who wants a cheap ass buggy  . Just kidding,well kinda,lol. To build the horse power up in a vw to equal an Eco or subie it cost some coin and eventually most everyone will be going over to water for this reason. Terry has a sweet ride and he's correct about you got to get all your ducks in a row to have a climber this is true with any buggy. I say with your fab skills and some serious thinking and maybe a case or two of setting and staring at it you could make a good water cooled s/s. Just build it and put a really super quiet muffler on it and a kick ass stereo and I'll tape me climbing some evil pipeline and when you start having a/c withdraws and need a fix just play the tape while your climbing a hill,lmao. Chad
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| Author: | 2800passat [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 11:48 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
wow! a great op to bring up the Passat. lol no Kennedy adapter, flywheel, clutch, pressure plate, slave cyl, hi torque starter, 4 spyder diff,bus trans with weedle gears, oil cooler,...lol These days there is NO money to get got. And don't hang a w/c of the back without narrow baby chains. |
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| Author: | helmetguy [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 12:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
ive got two ac buggys that i try to keep running every week ,and its tough when both are climbers.My ss imo is all i ever need to climb hills.it will put me over hills that scare the sh t out of me,and i love vws!!! butttttt this year alone i broke a crank and had to replace the case and that was about $1400 alone!!!when i seen terrys sc eco i knew i was going to try it,not because of the power but because it had power and reliability.terry still has some tweaking to do on his chassis and then he will have it.morgan and i are switching buggys this winter (she gets the 2500 ss next year so look out guys!!!) im converting hers over to sc eco , so next year we will see how the wc vs vw hill climbing goes. my kid will probably still whip my azz!!!!! |
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| Author: | davidk [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 2:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Now that's funny lol. I might go dark side sometime lol I got two buggies. Still love my aircooled!!!! Posted using my iPhone
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| Author: | buggybarn [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 5:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
So why the baby chains ? And what is the actual weight difference I hear from 20 lbs to 100 lbs between eco and vw. I hate not to build a vw love them and there is no better sound than a pissed off stroker . As far as the vw engines goin places that's proven !!!! I like my 2 seater its finally dial in but its time for a ss and grow a sack and start hittin the big stuff . So I still don't know . I seen mike and his daughter at rush and yes there buggies climb . And so does terrys . Mike get that sc in your buggy real quick and let me know how it does lol. |
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| Author: | helmetguy [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 5:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
Lol!! I wish it would be quick but there is a imo alot to changing this over and getting it correct. If i cant get it right i will be the first one to let you know.after morgan said i told you so!!!!! Lol!!!!:grin: Posted using the WoodsBuggy Mobile App |
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| Author: | gasman [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 6:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
I know a certain somebody, not mentioning any names,uh cough cough uh (mad mike), that has a wicked subie SS that if would ever get finished might be a good climber but I know it will be an awesome trail buggy. Guess I'll try and build one eventually but I'll wait til my ac blows up. Chad
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| Author: | 2800passat [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 7:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
So why the narrow baby chains? A little added ground heigth, any ratio you desire, a better weight distribution for the w/c, transmission longevity and if too wide your buggy will twist as it grips and slips, and you won't have much of a playing field on a hill climb.Basicly a bearing needs to go INSIDE the driver sprocket, not 2 off to the side . Saves a lot of space! |
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| Author: | buggybarn [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: watercooled vs air cooled hill climbing ? |
2800passat wrote: So why the narrow baby chains? A little added ground heigth, any ratio you desire, a better weight distribution for the w/c, transmission longevity and if too wide your buggy will twist as it grips and slips, and you won't have much of a playing field on a hill climb.Basicly a bearing needs to go INSIDE the driver sprocket, not 2 off to the side . Saves a lot of space! Ok gotcha . Thanks for info passat |
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