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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:05 am 
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Firebug wrote:
wildwillie wrote:
im going to swap out an a/c vw to a suby so what do i need and this is for a buddy and he needs to do this cheep and ez..thanks guys..................................................


I think your on the wrong forum Larry :| The yahoo wants a water cooled buggy :idea:

I think its the thin skin thing again! :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:25 am 
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80 extra pounds in the back.... No problem.... Image Warn M8000 = 80 extra pounds in the front. Fixed! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:52 am 
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kyjr.buggy1 wrote:
I'm pretty sure he wasn't directing that to the original poster... (willie). Cause Willie knows that everything Dad said is true, and he'd tell you the same thing. Anybody who climbs anything you could actually consider a tough hill would... He was looking for the W/C motor for our buddy Terry. Dad was talking to everybody who started dogging the A/Cs. (Which yes, I started all that. :twisted: :lol: ) Just clearing that up.

-Dakotah/koko



It's cool KoKo,,,it it weren't for innovative ideas like your Dad's , Clayton's and DD's we might be all riding around in conventional buggys. Strong willed folks are good for the sport.
Even us yahoos can see that :D

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:07 am 
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Ours leaps as soon as you touch the throttle, 's just transient mapping :wink:

FWIW, we sold our old dellorto's and webbers for enough to pay for both the engine and wiring harness, and we've still got the old VW engine to sell bits off... :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:03 pm 
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First off Larry I like you and consider you a friend I hope you do after my rant, but I am going to give everyone my opinion. Which what you gave was your opinion. I think within the next 5-10 years a/c buggies will almost be obsolete. And I do like the big a/c's but I do believe you think vw is the only way to go. But some people like the challenge of trying something different.

kybuggy1 wrote:
But pulling a jet occasionally is a small price to pay to have a motor that revs instantly when you need it to, doesnt take 2 or 3 seconds to rev down,


Well The reason a water cooled rev's down so slow is because the computer makes it( new technology). Which is easier on the internals. And it don't matter how fast it comes off the rev's just how fast it rev's.

kybuggy1 wrote:
has lots of torque AND lots of power upstairs for its weight, and looks and sounds beautiful. YES I said torque.


And I don't know what you are calling alot of power and torque I would be willing to pay to see the actual dyno chart on one of these bad 2500's. I would be willing to bet they are not putting no more than 150hp/150tq at the wheels.

kybuggy1 wrote:
I dont know why all the waterpumper guys make big claims of all the torque they make. I aint been in a waterpumper conventional buggy yet that felt like it would pull a sick whore out of bed compared to any correctly built VW bigger than a 2276.


I will bet you a properly tuned stock ecotec make's more torque than most properly built 2276's. And I made the mistake of letting you drive mine when it was only pulling to about 3000 rpm, because I was having fueling issue's.

kybuggy1 wrote:
I have been outran ONCE by a waterpumper on a conventional buggy on them sissy ass competition hills we had,


How much seat time did this person have? On a dirtbike I can take a cr 125 and outrun most on cr 250's because I have years of seat time.

kybuggy1 wrote:
but I aint seen one yet that will even start up a real hill.


In time I promise you will, I just need to get some more time in the seat and tweaking to the buggy done. I feel I have come a long ways for just having mine in the woods 5 times. And two of which was competitions.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Somebody build a conventional waterpumper that leaps as soon as you touch the gas,


Mine does leap as soon as I touch the gas. Watch my qualifying run at D&K. That is alot of my problem controlling all the POWER.

kybuggy1 wrote:
will climb a REAL hill, stop in the middle without trying to flip back, and take off again to ride a wheelie out the top of that hill ...........


Working on it. AND IT WILL HAPPEN.

kybuggy1 wrote:
then yall can start talking shit.


I just talk it to my friends but as I can see some are thin skinned.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Until then, better make sure you dont try to follow any bad ass VWs off of the main trails, or you will be on you lid with that boat anchor trying to smash your melon.


I hope as I said hope next year I might be ready to follow some of those bad ass VWs

kybuggy1 wrote:
Nitro, wth do you know about carbs anyways?? How can you be so certain they're so troublesome when you aint never had a real performance VW, much less a set of dual carbs??? Is there something wrong with having enough knowledge of your engine components that you can fix them without the assistance of a computer ? Webers and Dellortos are marvels of highly functioning simplicity, just like an AC motor is.


Oh and a properly put together waterpumper won't leave you stranded.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Any yahoo can do some junkyarding a buy a harness and adapter and say they built a buggy. Those are the same type people who BUY a hotrod and claim to have built it themself to everybody they talk to at the rod runs.


And anyone can buy a Chuck Jones s/c frame, transmission, and 2500. Then bolt it together knowing it will work. Because it has been proven. But that is the reason I went watercooled is the challenge. By the way I did my harness, blueprinted my adapter plate, and flywheel.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Waterpumpers are ugly. They look out of place on the back of a sporty buggy. They sound gay on a buggy (except a v8 or a turbo on a CD).


Your opinion, some could say the same about vw's


kybuggy1 wrote:
They are heavy. (If you think 80 lbs dont matter on the ass end of a conventional, you know nothing about hillclimbing, 8 lbs matters).


It does and I believe some suspension tuning and rearranging can fix it.

kybuggy1 wrote:
They wont climb unless you run chains.


I will prove this wrong in time

kybuggy1 wrote:
Most of them wont turn enough rpms unless you modify them. (There goes the "they are cheaper " theory)


I can buy valve springs for 200 bucks and turn 8500 rpms. Is that enough rpms and cheap enough for you?


kybuggy1 wrote:
Their exhaust smells like traffic jams.


Just because it doesn't cost 6.00 a gallon I guess

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are sluggish, factory fuel injection is about as responsive as a county employee on overtime.


Mine is not sluggish, and I guess that is the reason most of the FASTEST drag cars are fuel injected.

kybuggy1 wrote:
If it breaks in the woods, you are headed to the trailer and going home usually.


Mine hasn't left me stranded yet

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are hard to tune the suspension under to climb.


That is the fun of it. Something not already figured out for you.

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are harder on chassis and driveline components (right Nitro?).


You have to build it a little tougher to handle the extra power :lol: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
They just suck. They are good for trailriders and family hauler buggies only.


Again just your opinion

kybuggy1 wrote:
Therefore my wife might get one, but I wont until one smacks me around doing what I love to do.


And next year me and my water-pumper is coming for you. :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:14 pm 
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i am building a traditional style buggy with a suby 2.5, it will be built around the water pumper and weight will be balanced perfect (or thats the plan) and yes its gonna be purpose built! i wont say what it will or wont do cause i dont know yet :wink: but weight wont be a issue! ive said many times i love the ky style buggies and i do! and you are all my friends! but my water pumper is coming for you next year aswell :wink: :twisted: :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:16 pm 
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kyjr.buggy1 wrote:
I'm pretty sure he wasn't directing that to the original poster... (willie). Cause Willie knows that everything Dad said is true, and he'd tell you the same thing. Anybody who climbs anything you could actually consider a tough hill would... He was looking for the W/C motor for our buddy Terry. Dad was talking to everybody who started dogging the A/Cs. (Which yes, I started all that. :twisted: :lol: ) Just clearing that up.

-Dakotah/koko

Exactly!


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:20 pm 
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WERE U THE GUY THAT SMACKED THE TREES AT THE BOTTOM ON THE MONEY RUN FOR THE A CLASS AT D AND K TERRY :?:

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:21 pm 
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lngtrvl2332 wrote:
80 extra pounds in the back.... No problem.... Image Warn M8000 = 80 extra pounds in the front. Fixed! :lol:

160 extra lbs!!!That is definitely, undoubtedly and unarquably a MAJOR problem when hillclimbing. Even a machine as powerful as a V8 CD or a setup like Clayton's would be HURT BAD by that much extra weight. Let alone a conventional style little buggy.


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:25 pm 
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8)


Last edited by kybuggy1 on Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:27 pm 
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Yeah John that was me :oops: My right rear tire was low and all I could think about was I had one run instead of two. Plus I can't drive :roll: :oops:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:46 pm 
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If you dont like watercooled stay off the watercooled forum! I dont see any watercooled guys constantly poluteing every post about somthing they dont like. Aircooled forum is on the next floor.

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:04 pm 
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Terry fryer wrote:
First off Larry I like you and consider you a friend I hope you do after my rant, but I am going to give everyone my opinion. Of course I still consider us friends, this is friendly goofin around to me. Which what you gave was your opinion. I think within the next 5-10 years a/c buggies will almost be obsolete. And I do like the big a/c's but I do believe you think vw is the only way to go. But some people like the challenge of trying something different. Some people like knowing what they build will work better than anything else.

kybuggy1 wrote:
But pulling a jet occasionally is a small price to pay to have a motor that revs instantly when you need it to, doesnt take 2 or 3 seconds to rev down,


Well The reason a water cooled rev's down so slow is because the computer makes it( new technology). Which is easier on the internals. And it don't matter how fast it comes off the rev's just how fast it rev's.
Yes it does. YOu dont want it to still be turnin revs when you need to blip the throttle just a hair so it still carries your wheelie but doesnt carry it TOO high.

kybuggy1 wrote:
has lots of torque AND lots of power upstairs for its weight, and looks and sounds beautiful. YES I said torque.


And I don't know what you are calling alot of power and torque I would be willing to pay to see the actual dyno chart on one of these bad 2500's. I would be willing to bet they are not putting no more than 150hp/150tq at the wheels. I'd be willing to bet thats wrong. Look at CB charts and guesstimate from that. Doesnt matter anyways. Its WHEN the power comes on and how quickly it gets there that matters most.

kybuggy1 wrote:
I dont know why all the waterpumper guys make big claims of all the torque they make. I aint been in a waterpumper conventional buggy yet that felt like it would pull a sick whore out of bed compared to any correctly built VW bigger than a 2276.


I will bet you a properly tuned stock ecotec make's more torque than most properly built 2276's. And I made the mistake of letting you drive mine when it was only pulling to about 3000 rpm, because I was having fueling issue's. The torque I wanted to feel should come in way before 3000 rpm. IT screams up top and I'm sure it makes more hp than mine or most any 2500 except maybe an all out drag motor. Most other 2500s prolly make more hp than mine too. Mine was built for torque. I run out of power way before most 2nd gear 2500s do and way before your ecotech. But I can stop n start anywhere I want other than a sheer bluff. Can you? Your roof says NO :lol: "

kybuggy1 wrote:
I have been outran ONCE by a waterpumper on a conventional buggy on them sissy ass competition hills we had,


How much seat time did this person have? On a dirtbike I can take a cr 125 and outrun most on cr 250's because I have years of seat time. Didnt mean nothing personal. At least you have the cajones to enter the event with a w/c conventional. I think you and Nitro are the only two that did at any of the events. But, if they are so much better, even a first timer should kick my butt every time, right?

kybuggy1 wrote:
but I aint seen one yet that will even start up a real hill.


In time I promise you will, I just need to get some more time in the seat and tweaking to the buggy done. I feel I have come a long ways for just having mine in the woods 5 times. And two of which was competitions. You are doing great. I never said you wasnt. But imagine how good you'd be doing if you could relate to other buggies with a similiar setup and they could help you.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Somebody build a conventional waterpumper that leaps as soon as you touch the gas,


Mine does leap as soon as I touch the gas. Watch my qualifying run at D&K. That is alot of my problem controlling all the POWER. Not IMO.You need to drive mine. OR Scotts, Brians, Bruce's, David's, Chris' (RWB), Troys old buggy, RON's, Willie's, Rhondas, (I could go on for 40 names) Unless your off idle response improved when you fixed the fueling problems there is no comparison.

kybuggy1 wrote:
will climb a REAL hill, stop in the middle without trying to flip back, and take off again to ride a wheelie out the top of that hill ...........


Working on it. AND IT WILL HAPPEN.

kybuggy1 wrote:
then yall can start talking shit.


I just talk it to my friends but as I can see some are thin skinned. I am not. This is a ball. I finally spoke how I really feel about waterslumpers. :lol: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
Until then, better make sure you dont try to follow any bad ass VWs off of the main trails, or you will be on you lid with that boat anchor trying to smash your melon.


I hope as I said hope next year I might be ready to follow some of those bad ass VWs

kybuggy1 wrote:
Nitro, wth do you know about carbs anyways?? How can you be so certain they're so troublesome when you aint never had a real performance VW, much less a set of dual carbs??? Is there something wrong with having enough knowledge of your engine components that you can fix them without the assistance of a computer ? Webers and Dellortos are marvels of highly functioning simplicity, just like an AC motor is.


Oh and a properly put together waterpumper won't leave you stranded.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Any yahoo can do some junkyarding a buy a harness and adapter and say they built a buggy. Those are the same type people who BUY a hotrod and claim to have built it themself to everybody they talk to at the rod runs.


And anyone can buy a Chuck Jones s/c frame, transmission, and 2500. Then bolt it together knowing it will work. Because it has been proven. But that is the reason I went watercooled is the challenge. By the way I did my harness, blueprinted my adapter plate, and flywheel. Chuck did not build my frame (I wish he did). Setting the torsions and locating everything in the buggy is what matters anyways. He does give awesome advice on this stuff to everyone though. No one can help you with as much certainty they are telling you right. Why go thru that ? While you experiment n change stuff, I'll be in the woods having fun. I seen a few thrown together ss buggies with good stuff in them that have lots of troubles.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Waterpumpers are ugly. They look out of place on the back of a sporty buggy. They sound gay on a buggy (except a v8 or a turbo on a CD).


Your opinion, some could say the same about vw's


kybuggy1 wrote:
They are heavy. (If you think 80 lbs dont matter on the ass end of a conventional, you know nothing about hillclimbing, 8 lbs matters).


It does and I believe some suspension tuning and rearranging can fix it.

kybuggy1 wrote:
They wont climb unless you run chains.


I will prove this wrong in time

kybuggy1 wrote:
Most of them wont turn enough rpms unless you modify them. (There goes the "they are cheaper " theory)


I can buy valve springs for 200 bucks and turn 8500 rpms. Is that enough rpms and cheap enough for you?
Cheap enough yes. Is it pulling or just spinning up there?


kybuggy1 wrote:
Their exhaust smells like traffic jams.


Just because it doesn't cost 6.00 a gallon I guess 5 gallons for a weekend. If $30 keeps someone home, they should prolly be workin insteadof riding

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are sluggish, factory fuel injection is about as responsive as a county employee on overtime.


Mine is not sluggish, and I guess that is the reason most of the FASTEST drag cars are fuel injected. Drag cars are not responsive , they are designed for most hp possible at whatever rpm that happens to be. (two step, transbrake, fancy clutch setups, hi end convertors, etc to get then up to correct launch rpm range

kybuggy1 wrote:
If it breaks in the woods, you are headed to the trailer and going home usually.


Mine hasn't left me stranded yet. YET. maybe never. but if it does, who you gonna borrow a part off of so your weekend aint ruined?

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are hard to tune the suspension under to climb.


That is the fun of it. Something not already figured out for you.

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are harder on chassis and driveline components (right Nitro?).


You have to build it a little tougher to handle the extra power :lol: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
They just suck. They are good for trailriders and family hauler buggies only.


Again just your opinion

kybuggy1 wrote:
Therefore my wife might get one, but I wont until one smacks me around doing what I love to do.


And next year me and my water-pumper is coming for you. :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol: Bring it!! :D I hope to see you in the woods ALOT!! But you may be home tweaking on it too much to have time to ride.

You may well prove me wrong on every bit of this. It would be killer if you did. I think if any w/c I been around could do it, it would be the ecotec. BUT YOU GOT A LONG WAY TO GO!! :lol: :twisted: :lol:

Thought you was going another direction?? Glad you aint. Prove me wrong. Save me a few grand in a few years. In the meantime, I'll go ride!! :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:05 pm 
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SubySteve wrote:
If you dont like watercooled stay off the watercooled forum! I dont see any watercooled guys constantly poluteing every post about somthing they dont like dont like. Aircooled forum is on the next floor.


Now how much fun would that be?? :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:36 pm 
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When I get the kids to bed I'll be back. This is getting fun.


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 10:06 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 10:26 pm 
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Our current WBHC champion runs water cooled,, and it is as conventional as any buggy not running a stock VW engine and sedan tranny. But I will agree that most of the hopped up VW buggys will beat me any day. Just as soon as they get cranked,,warmed up.. and tuned ...Let's do this,,,,let them sit overnight,,,,pointed at a decent hill,,,then at sunrise we will foot race 50 ft..jump in our buggys,,,and hit the hill. That would be fun. 8)

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 10:35 pm 
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lmao :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 10:48 pm 
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OK I am back
kybuggy1 wrote:
Terry fryer wrote:
First off Larry I like you and consider you a friend I hope you do after my rant, but I am going to give everyone my opinion. Of course I still consider us friends, this is friendly goofin around to me. Which what you gave was your opinion. I think within the next 5-10 years a/c buggies will almost be obsolete. And I do like the big a/c's but I do believe you think vw is the only way to go. But some people like the challenge of trying something different. Some people like knowing what they build will work better than anything else.
And again if people didn't try diffrent things we would still be riding around in pan buggies
kybuggy1 wrote:
But pulling a jet occasionally is a small price to pay to have a motor that revs instantly when you need it to, doesnt take 2 or 3 seconds to rev down,


Well The reason a water cooled rev's down so slow is because the computer makes it( new technology). Which is easier on the internals. And it don't matter how fast it comes off the rev's just how fast it rev's.
Yes it does. YOu dont want it to still be turnin revs when you need to blip the throttle just a hair so it still carries your wheelie but doesnt carry it TOO high.
In that circumstance it depends on how well your tires are grabbing and how fast your tires are turning for your rpm if you are off the clutch, I thought you was talking about free revving. Just about all of them are gonna come down the same with the clutch out
kybuggy1 wrote:
has lots of torque AND lots of power upstairs for its weight, and looks and sounds beautiful. YES I said torque.


And I don't know what you are calling alot of power and torque I would be willing to pay to see the actual dyno chart on one of these bad 2500's. I would be willing to bet they are not putting no more than 150hp/150tq at the wheels. I'd be willing to bet thats wrong. Look at CB charts and guesstimate from that. Doesnt matter anyways. Its WHEN the power comes on and how quickly it gets there that matters most.I have been looking around and most of them are at the crank. Plus most of them are full race motors not woods motors.

kybuggy1 wrote:
I dont know why all the waterpumper guys make big claims of all the torque they make. I aint been in a waterpumper conventional buggy yet that felt like it would pull a sick whore out of bed compared to any correctly built VW bigger than a 2276.


I will bet you a properly tuned stock ecotec make's more torque than most properly built 2276's. And I made the mistake of letting you drive mine when it was only pulling to about 3000 rpm, because I was having fueling issue's. The torque I wanted to feel should come in way before 3000 rpm. IT screams up top and I'm sure it makes more hp than mine or most any 2500 except maybe an all out drag motor. Most other 2500s prolly make more hp than mine too. Mine was built for torque. I run out of power way before most 2nd gear 2500s do and way before your ecotech. But I can stop n start anywhere I want other than a sheer bluff. Can you? Your roof says NO :lol: " And I forgot I had a vacuum leak to the day you rode it so yes it is twice as responsive as it was. Plus I run a 4.86 r/p vs. your 5.43 and a higher 2nd gear. Talking about torque that is almost like you taking off and climbing in 3rd gear.

kybuggy1 wrote:
I have been outran ONCE by a waterpumper on a conventional buggy on them sissy ass competition hills we had,


How much seat time did this person have? On a dirtbike I can take a cr 125 and outrun most on cr 250's because I have years of seat time. Didnt mean nothing personal. At least you have the cajones to enter the event with a w/c conventional. I think you and Nitro are the only two that did at any of the events. But, if they are so much better, even a first timer should kick my butt every time, right?
I believe it is 70% driver 30% buggy.And I can't drive so it is all buggy. The waterpumper didn't do to bad against alot of those 2500's with driver's. Just imagine what the water pumper would do with a driver. :lol: :lol: Maybe I can talk pipedope into driving it next year :lol: :lol:
kybuggy1 wrote:
but I aint seen one yet that will even start up a real hill.


In time I promise you will, I just need to get some more time in the seat and tweaking to the buggy done. I feel I have come a long ways for just having mine in the woods 5 times. And two of which was competitions. You are doing great. I never said you wasnt. But imagine how good you'd be doing if you could relate to other buggies with a similiar setup and they could help you.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Somebody build a conventional waterpumper that leaps as soon as you touch the gas,


Mine does leap as soon as I touch the gas. Watch my qualifying run at D&K. That is alot of my problem controlling all the POWER. Not IMO.You need to drive mine. OR Scotts, Brians, Bruce's, David's, Chris' (RWB), Troys old buggy, RON's, Willie's, Rhondas, (I could go on for 40 names) Unless your off idle response improved when you fixed the fueling problems there is no comparison. And like i said watch the qualifying video of mine from d&k. I just need to figure out how to keep the front end down when I get in it. It is responding well to well for me maybe I should of went a/c so I could control it easier :twisted: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
will climb a REAL hill, stop in the middle without trying to flip back, and take off again to ride a wheelie out the top of that hill ...........


Working on it. AND IT WILL HAPPEN.

kybuggy1 wrote:
then yall can start talking shit.


I just talk it to my friends but as I can see some are thin skinned. I am not. This is a ball. I finally spoke how I really feel about waterslumpers. :lol: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
Until then, better make sure you dont try to follow any bad ass VWs off of the main trails, or you will be on you lid with that boat anchor trying to smash your melon.


I hope as I said hope next year I might be ready to follow some of those bad ass VWs

kybuggy1 wrote:
Nitro, wth do you know about carbs anyways?? How can you be so certain they're so troublesome when you aint never had a real performance VW, much less a set of dual carbs??? Is there something wrong with having enough knowledge of your engine components that you can fix them without the assistance of a computer ? Webers and Dellortos are marvels of highly functioning simplicity, just like an AC motor is.


Oh and a properly put together waterpumper won't leave you stranded.

kybuggy1 wrote:
Any yahoo can do some junkyarding a buy a harness and adapter and say they built a buggy. Those are the same type people who BUY a hotrod and claim to have built it themself to everybody they talk to at the rod runs.


And anyone can buy a Chuck Jones s/c frame, transmission, and 2500. Then bolt it together knowing it will work. Because it has been proven. But that is the reason I went watercooled is the challenge. By the way I did my harness, blueprinted my adapter plate, and flywheel. Chuck did not build my frame (I wish he did). Setting the torsions and locating everything in the buggy is what matters anyways. He does give awesome advice on this stuff to everyone though. No one can help you with as much certainty they are telling you right. Why go thru that ? While you experiment n change stuff, I'll be in the woods having fun. I seen a few thrown together ss buggies with good stuff in them that have lots of troubles.
Any yahoo can move things around and fiddle with the torsion till they get it right :lol: :lol: :twisted: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
Waterpumpers are ugly. They look out of place on the back of a sporty buggy. They sound gay on a buggy (except a v8 or a turbo on a CD).


Your opinion, some could say the same about vw's


kybuggy1 wrote:
They are heavy. (If you think 80 lbs dont matter on the ass end of a conventional, you know nothing about hillclimbing, 8 lbs matters).


It does and I believe some suspension tuning and rearranging can fix it.

kybuggy1 wrote:
They wont climb unless you run chains.


I will prove this wrong in time

kybuggy1 wrote:
Most of them wont turn enough rpms unless you modify them. (There goes the "they are cheaper " theory)


I can buy valve springs for 200 bucks and turn 8500 rpms. Is that enough rpms and cheap enough for you?
Cheap enough yes. Is it pulling or just spinning up there? And yes it will still be pulling go to zzperformance.com and look at some of the dyno graphs. Mine was still pulling at 7200 steady but I did not have the injectors to supply the fuel so it was getting lean. So that is why I have a 7200 rev limiter, But I will have all that fixed by next year


kybuggy1 wrote:
Their exhaust smells like traffic jams.


Just because it doesn't cost 6.00 a gallon I guess 5 gallons for a weekend. If $30 keeps someone home, they should prolly be workin insteadof riding

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are sluggish, factory fuel injection is about as responsive as a county employee on overtime.


Mine is not sluggish, and I guess that is the reason most of the FASTEST drag cars are fuel injected. Drag cars are not responsive , they are designed for most hp possible at whatever rpm that happens to be. (two step, transbrake, fancy clutch setups, hi end convertors, etc to get then up to correct launch rpm rangeOk you got me there. I should of used another example try desert racing, formula 1, any type of racing that is not to restrictive or just google it and see what you come up with.

kybuggy1 wrote:
If it breaks in the woods, you are headed to the trailer and going home usually.


Mine hasn't left me stranded yet. YET. maybe never. but if it does, who you gonna borrow a part off of so your weekend aint ruined?

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are hard to tune the suspension under to climb.


That is the fun of it. Something not already figured out for you.

kybuggy1 wrote:
They are harder on chassis and driveline components (right Nitro?).


You have to build it a little tougher to handle the extra power :lol: :lol:

kybuggy1 wrote:
They just suck. They are good for trailriders and family hauler buggies only.


Again just your opinion

kybuggy1 wrote:
Therefore my wife might get one, but I wont until one smacks me around doing what I love to do.


And next year me and my water-pumper is coming for you. :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol: Bring it!! :D I hope to see you in the woods ALOT!! But you may be home tweaking on it too much to have time to ride.

You may well prove me wrong on every bit of this. It would be killer if you did. I think if any w/c I been around could do it, it would be the ecotec. BUT YOU GOT A LONG WAY TO GO!! :lol: :twisted: :lol:
Oh I know I have a long way to go but not the buggy. :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol:

Thought you was going another direction?? Glad you aint. Prove me wrong. Save me a few grand in a few years. In the meantime, I'll go ride!! :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:17 pm 
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I love all the buggys wc or ac. :D I don't care if anybody can beat me up a hill :lol: My wc buggy is heavy,has gone everywhere I wanted to go with it and I LOVE MY ECOTEC and will never go back :!: :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 9:06 am 
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Firebug wrote:
Our current WBHC champion runs water cooled,, and it is as conventional as any buggy not running a stock VW engine and sedan tranny. But I will agree that most of the hopped up VW buggys will beat me any day. Just as soon as they get cranked,,warmed up.. and tuned ...Let's do this,,,,let them sit overnight,,,,pointed at a decent hill,,,then at sunrise we will foot race 50 ft..jump in our buggys,,,and hit the hill. That would be fun. 8)

Are you serious? Are we talking about the same yellow Outfront Subie w/ turbo and nitrous, 40" tires, powerglide, midengine, Supra turbo rear diff, 934s with $900 (each) axles buggy that Clayton owns?? It Is incredible, but what is conventional about it?? Conventional is rear engine and a transaxle, or at least IMO is in. Laid out like the original concept of a buggy....a beetle pan with a rollbar on it.

BTW, I'll take you up on that challenge. Could be fun. $1000? Not a decent hill though, how about a killer hill....something like Beechtree hill. I'm sure you will beat me in the foot race and maybe cold start (maybe). We'll prolly both end up on our lids, but its easier to flip mine back over and take off again :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 9:59 am 
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Weight transfer is more important than weight ever will be.... Suspension tuning and initial balancing of the layout of the machine will always yield the best results IMO. I love buggies but all the weight behind the wheels + no weight in the front (most traditional buggies) = wheelies on flat ground so how is that optimal for a 60 degree grade? My old buggy had the heaviest nose and the heaviest rear skid plate of any of the buggies I ride with and I could roll up hills worry free that they were praying to keep the front end down on. I am not a hill climb champion (I'll climb the hills, you guys can race up them) so I could just be blowing smoke, but I have seen circle track friends add 200lbs. to their car in the form of a properly placed piece of train rail and walk away with the race on a slick night.


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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:39 am 
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kybuggy1 wrote:
Firebug wrote:
Our current WBHC champion runs water cooled,, and it is as conventional as any buggy not running a stock VW engine and sedan tranny. But I will agree that most of the hopped up VW buggys will beat me any day. Just as soon as they get cranked,,warmed up.. and tuned ...Let's do this,,,,let them sit overnight,,,,pointed at a decent hill,,,then at sunrise we will foot race 50 ft..jump in our buggys,,,and hit the hill. That would be fun. 8)

Are you serious? Are we talking about the same yellow Outfront Subie w/ turbo and nitrous, 40" tires, powerglide, midengine, Supra turbo rear diff, 934s with $900 (each) axles buggy that Clayton owns?? It Is incredible, but what is conventional about it?? Conventional is rear engine and a transaxle, or at least IMO is in. Laid out like the original concept of a buggy....a beetle pan with a rollbar on it.

BTW, I'll take you up on that challenge. Could be fun. $1000? Not a decent hill though, how about a killer hill....something like Beechtree hill. I'm sure you will beat me in the foot race and maybe cold start (maybe). We'll prolly both end up on our lids, but its easier to flip mine back over and take off again :wink:


apparently conventional is in the eye of the beholder.. if it aint stock it aint conventional...find a new word. How about cookie cutter :mrgreen: OK,,to the challenge, bring it to Corinth this weekend,,I might even talk Mr.Paul into letting your family in free again,,,or , meet you in Tennessee,,I don't think I can make it to your playground,,and forget the grand, I aint got your money :wink: It's gotta be for fun,,If I win I will praise AC for a week,,,if you win ,,you praise WC for a day. Windrock is pleasant. Gotta lot of friends at LBL too,,,even PicWic. Turkey Bay????.I'm game,, buggy ready,,,let's do it :!:

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:10 pm 
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What is conventional? I'm pretty certain a bettle tub with a rollbar ain't climbin sh!t :|

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 Post subject: Re: need some help
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 1:32 pm 
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lngtrvl2332 wrote:
Weight transfer is more important than weight ever will be.... Suspension tuning and initial balancing of the layout of the machine will always yield the best results IMO. I love buggies but all the weight behind the wheels + no weight in the front (most traditional buggies) = wheelies on flat ground so how is that optimal for a 60 degree grade? My old buggy had the heaviest nose and the heaviest rear skid plate of any of the buggies I ride with and I could roll up hills worry free that they were praying to keep the front end down on. I am not a hill climb champion (I'll climb the hills, you guys can race up them) so I could just be blowing smoke, but I have seen circle track friends add 200lbs. to their car in the form of a properly placed piece of train rail and walk away with the race on a slick night.

If the suspension is set up right, a light weight ss will NOT wheelie on flatground, unless you make it. I can just about guarantee I can park my buggy uphill on a steeper hill than any tank buggy can without my front end trying to come over. Ours may look too light in the front, but its all about the balance. Why dont you come to a place that CDs even have to carry their front end to climb? I aint talkin about the little bumps in some parks that the people who ride there all the time call "hills"...you know hills that a Gator can go up in reverse aint a hill.
If you aint in a wheelie, you aint got good traction. Period. Some buggies may climb decent on all four, but that same buggy would climb better with most the weight on the drive wheels, and less total weight altogether. Your buddies who are praying for their front to stay down dont know how to climb real challenges. I pray for mine to lift about a foot or two and carry it right there. A circle track car is about the furthest motor sport away from hillclimbing that there is.


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